Are you a self-defined worrier? Though you are likely all too familiar with this feeling, let's define what it means to worry. Worrying is ruminating about a negative outcome, often times completely out of your control.

Kelley Wolf has worked to identify the methods for finding love over worry, and achieving a state of flow, or peace and joy. But she also recognizes that worrying will never totally disappear, and even gets vulnerable sharing her own recent worries. In doing so she walks us through her approach to working through those feelings, including the words she actually says out loud.

Although Kelley does share where she thinks you can start, and a few of her simple tips, we both emphasize that this is a slow, but worthy process. If you have struggled with an all-or-nothing mindset that leaves you spiraling in your worry, or completely numbing yourself to it, then this is the episode you need to just get started in a better direction.

About a few other things...

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Songs Credit: Pleasant Pictures Music Club

TRANSCRIPT

Monica: Kelley Wolf welcome to about progress.

Kelley: Thank you. I'm so happy to be here.

Monica: I, I love you already. And I think my audience is just going to not only love you, but love what you bring to the table today. Cuz it's so unique. I, I haven't really heard about this very much and I also think it's immediately applicable to what we face every day as really busy women with a lot of responsibilities and we hear the word flow a lot.

Right now, you know, we hear about, you know, with work or creativity or other ways, but you have a different perspective on flow and, and your own take on it. So I would love for you to just introduce that idea to us and how you came to discover what you think of flow

Kelley: It's funny that you said that flow the most used word ever that I made the title of my book.

Monica: Yep.

Kelley: No. So what it was for me, Is, I'm a coach just similar to you. And over the 10 years that I was coaching, this is pretty early on in my, in my career. I would hear people talk about flow. They would be just talking about whatever and they would say, oh, and then I was just in flow and it was so good.

So whenever somebody talks about flow, their energy completely shifts, they become elevated. It's the most delicious, yummy vibration, and coaches would know this or anybody who's been coach would know this.

 So what I did, I didn't tell the people that I was just doing this as I was working, I started to look for a pattern or some kind of trajectory, and I noticed over time, and it was probably over the course of, I would say two years that there was a pretty consistent pattern, which was, if a person felt the state of flow and identified it as such, they had done something they had chose love, gratitude over fear and worry. And that held true if the flow state was brought upon by surfing or skydiving, as well as the flow state of driving your car, when all the things just get glittery and wonderful, and you don't even know why. They both were true. It was something that happened in the mind that love and gratitude took over from fear and worry and concern. And then it just happened every time. So then my next process was what if I worked on this with people? What if we started to challenge it and work on it? Could we get a hold of the flow state? You know, it seems like this elusive thing that you don't get to have, unless you're just lucky and it passes you by, or you jump out of an airplane.

Both things are not true. So over time I noticed, yes, this is actually, this is true. Flow for me is finding love over worry for anybody that doesn't know, finding love over worry. And it sounds both too simple and too complicated all at the same time, but we'll

Monica: As all good things do

Kelley: we'll talk

Monica: Right.

Kelley: more about it as, as we keep talking, but that's really where it, where it started.

Monica: I love hearing the origins of this because you really were just in the weeds. Doing the work, you know, for yourself and for the women that you work with. But I I'm a how girl and maybe you are too. I always just want to know. So how, how, and that I love that that's how you came to discover this is, is, is to grab this pattern so that we can then replicate it.

I want to, before we teach them more about how to start doing this, and we'll also say, you know, read the book, obviously that's gonna be a lot more

Kelley: That will help

Monica: Yeah. That will help a lot.

Kelley: yeah, for sure.

Monica: I wanna just ask you though, did you at first think this could only be applied to "important" I'm putting this in quotes scenarios, you know, like a really important state of creativity or a really important conversation. And, and then how were you able to then translate that to actual real life situations too?

Kelley: We all want to live in more peace. You know, every single one of us wants to live in more peace. It's why self-help books are the most purchased books on earth. And also the least read, little fun side note. We buy them, but we don't read them. There's a draw to it.

There's a desire to find out. Flow as a concept. And as a state of mind is, feels like this big, complicated thing. Big books have been written about this big studies have been done about it. My curiosity was, not can you just consistently be wandering around, like you just jumped out of an airplane because that's impossible, but could, or, or, or whatever that is, but could we be a seeking more peace consistently throughout the day?

And B, could it just be, I'm gonna say an 80, 20 life or even a 70, 30.

Monica: Uhhuh.

What do you mean by

Kelley: of the time I feel more joyful and peaceful, even just peace let's take flow out of it and, and call it peace or joy. Could I have that more than the other, which one gets to take the front seat? I think oftentimes, I don't know.

And I just use this from friends and clients and just observing the world. We, I don't know if it's happened in the last two years or if we've kind of always been this way. We don't, we tend the other direction. We tip towards more frantic, more fear, more worry than the other. And no person on planet earth is gonna be a hundred percent of the time in flow.

Peace, calm. No, no one literally no one, no great mass person suffering is inevitable. Suffering is part of the human experience. For me, it was, we were, we will suffer. You will have incredibly complicated experiences. If you are lucky enough to live, you know, to keep going. And we need tools to not then get trapped in worry.

That's my biggest, biggest lesson, because the things, the hard things will keep coming. but you can, we all can, we can literally lodge ourselves in a state of mind that is riddled with worry, concern, and fear. You can also lodge yourself in a state of mind that is committed to seeking joy, seeking flow and seeking peace.

Monica: It makes us more, it makes us more reachable,

you know, because before I thought it's really hard for me to just switch my thoughts and control them all the time. Now I've done a lot of work on that. A lot of, you know, cognitive therapy, also coaching, stuff like that. So I know it's not. A hundred

Kelley: It's not that easy. No, no, no, no.

Monica: But even with that, it helps me reframe what flow even looks like that it really is just, just that little bit more of a push and a reaching for peace for love. Let's let's do this in a context that might really help the women put it to practice too. Like, and I'm, I'm thinking about this in terms of curve balls.

You know, we get curve balls thrown at us and some of 'em are like little "c" curve balls, just, you know, someone getting sick in your family right when you have to be somewhere and do so like things like that happening. And then the big "c" curve balls, you know, like illness or like I, the past couple years, the big "c" curve balls for me have been my children.

like literally having nervous breakdowns during

COVID, you know? Yeah. So let's apply that. How, how can flow the state of, you know, seeking for more peace? How can it apply to both of those

Kelley: Yeah. Big C little C. Well, here's a great fun irony for you or not, or who knows? Who cares? I am. Sitting in this day, in this moment, in this minute, in this hour in a big "c" curve ball and more than one, actually definitely more than one. So here's the beauty of the universe I am being have I listened to the things that I believe are the truth and the way, you know, I wrote this book called flow, finding love over worry.

I didn't make this up.

know, this was made up thousands and thousands and thousands and thousands of years ago, I have put it into a package that I think is memorable, accessible, and is something you can, when you're falling down the hill, you can go, what was that thing again? What was that thing? And you can grab it.

It's like a

Monica: it's like

Kelley: parachute cord, you know, and that. Was important to me, but this isn't new. Part of actually the flow practice, ironically is we must first take care of ourselves. That is paramount, key, everything. So everything around me, it goes me, then my children, my husband, my family, then my town then blah, blah, blah.

And it keeps going out from there. So I am a current state of myopic care so that I can be conscious about what's happening around me and what's happening next, but here's how it works for me. So here's an exact example. Last night, two nights ago, I found myself on what I call the worry train. So worry for those of you who need a definition is a ruminating thought typically based in a negative outcome. Okay. So worry is not an emotion we have to delineate that it's not an emotion. Worry is a thought and it likes to stay with you. It likes to hang out. it tends to not have solutions. It just is icky

Monica: It's

almost an action too, right? Because I mean, when I think about worrying, even if you're thinking about as a thought,

Kelley: Mm-hmm,

Monica: it, it, it, it makes me act different

too.

Kelley: our energy changes. We, we, we make poor decisions, so I don't wanna jump too far ahead of this, but when we get stuck there and when that becomes our operating system, Way past the big sea curve vault. You'll still be there. You'll look at the world through the lens. Of of fear and worry. And I'm very conscious of that.

And very careful of that. I don't wanna stay here forever. I can tell you that right now in that feeling, in that sensation. So one of the tools that I use when I'm in the big C, so I'm talking I'm a 3:00 AM, wake, wake up big C like panic button. You know that, you know what I'm talking about?

That one's fun. And it's like, you you're, you're half asleep. You're kind of awake and you. You're just in it and it's so icky and it feels so scary and horrible. And then you like go from one scary to the next that doesn't even have anything to do anything. Like what if my dog gets hit by a car? I it's just the most absurd pile on.

Right. So what I do and this, we can probably get into this in a minute in the flow work. It's stop. I say this out. on. Hold on. Sweet girl. Hold on. You are worrying right now. I have to name it. You are worrying right now. The next thing I do is I look around the room and I go, okay, I'm in. So I'm actually currently my parents' house right now.

Not living here, but just, we're just visiting here. And I. Go. Oh, you're in, you're in your parents' house and there's that thing over there that you recognize and there's that, and I'll slowly, your body will start to calm down a little bit. And then I start to tell myself some things that are good in that moment.

You know, in this particular moment, my daughter had come and gotten in my bed and she's sleeping there. I'm like, oh, she's. There's my daughter. She's safe. She's good. There's my dog. Oh, they're safe. They're good. Okay. Had a great meal last night. That's amazing. What a, what a lucky person I am that my tummy is for right now.

Okay. This sounds so simplistic. And I do not want people to think that it's that easy and that simplistic, however, because worry is a thought and those are thoughts. They can be in the same room with each other. You know what I'm saying? One gets to win over the. If that makes any sense. I can't control what's happening, you know, I can't, I can't stop.

Like you said, a big illness or the big, scary curve balls, but I can choose to in that moment to calm my body down, I can choose to look at the world and the lens through what is right. Instead of what is.

Monica: mm-hmm

Kelley: then what I often say to myself, and this is so interesting. I usually fall back asleep, which I love, you know, it's like, oh right, okay.

We're good. I fall back asleep. And sometimes before I fall asleep, I say, we can work on this tomorrow. I mean, I just say it out loud, like, don't worry. I mean, don't worry, we'll work on this tomorrow. This isn't the time for it. That's actually happening to me right now. And that's actually the practice that I believe in.

It sounds like hyperbole, and it sounds like I loved your podcast. Cause it's what you said. We're not robots. There is no thing that works fast and quick and it doesn't, it doesn't exist. It is. Impossible's a slow process, built brick by brick, you know, and that's how it's gotta ha it's just gonna be like that forever.

There is no destination. There is no, there, there, so let's just get that off the table. you know, we can't, that's not real. So this is the practice that I use to. Pull myself back to center and then the next day maybe another curve ball comes. Right. But at least I didn't, I'm not staying. I'm not sticking and I'm not building a house on the worry hill.

Monica: Ooh, that to me totally sums up exactly what this is for, because it's not like you're neglecting the worries or ignoring them or putting your head in the stand. It's how you're showing up to them and showing up as your full self. Which also is a self that's allowed to, to feel the negative feelings too.

So

I like that you give yourself permission. Can we a, can we talk on that a little bit more? Cuz that's the thing I feel like women in my community really struggle with is they either do the all or nothing with this where they say, anytime I feel a negative emotion, I should just change my thought and completely do away with that

emotion.

Or they don't even try because it's. Hard to do, but, but it's still an all or nothing frame in their

mind. Right. So how do we still make space for the negative emotions? And I, I, and I think, you know, the proper processing too, of letting them be part of it too. I, I, I know this is how you view things, but explain that to, to these women who are struggling

Kelley: Well, I would love to meet the person who doesn't have emotions or you know, remember back in the day, like power positive thinking. And, and it's like the, you could

Monica: the toxic positivity

Kelley: yes, you could think that this is the power of positive thinking, but when you dive into it, you'll understand that it is that it is not it's really to identify the difference between what is an active experience that needs my attention versus what is worry.

Okay. Worry. Not productive

Monica: okay.

Kelley: that are hard and challenging. There's lots of productive things that are uncomfortable worry. Isn't really one of them. So it's about knowing that you are worrying as, as corny as it might sound or feel. It's really knowing when it's happening.

And here's what I think your, your listeners will feel. And this's what I feel. We think worry's doing something. We actually think it's, it's helping, you know, if I think hard enough and long enough about this one negative thing, I'll come up with some solution. But what we have found is the solutions tend to come when we have removed the clutter of our mind, let's say, in the meditation or on a walk or not that not that grind of the mind.

You know, it doesn't actually really do anything. It's such a bruiser to take that in. Cause man, it feels like it does, but the more you unpack it, you realize that it, that isn't real. So you're always gonna worry. You're always going to feel it. And in this case, we're going to say, I see you. That is worry.

I'm not, we're gonna, I'm still gonna feel bad. So like if we use that example from last. I'm still really scared about what I'm dealing with right

Monica: Mm-hmm

Kelley: You know, I, I am, it's a lot, there's a lot of dynamics that are going on and I feel the whole range of emotions and I have children, you have children. So I'm feeling through them.

You know, I we're all the same. All of us on planet earth are processing things that way. But what I really, really catch myself. Is when I get on the worry roller coaster, I can still be scared and feel what I'm feeling, but it's not gonna help me to go, okay, well, if we, if we move to that town, then what if my son got bullied in that school?

And then I, and then, and then in three years he was, he, this happened and then in four, do you know you guys all, please? I hope everybody knows what I'm talking about.

Monica: 100%.

Kelley: Okay. That's worry.

Monica: Mm-hmm the ruminating over

Kelley: The ruminating thought. Is that productive? That would be a question I would ask everybody listening right now. Take a moment and ask yourself that exact line of thinking that I just said is that productive, really challenge that for a minute. I think most of us when challenging, it would say, no, it's not. Some of us would be like, isn't it because I do have control you don't we don't have control. I don't have control over three years from now. Whether or not my son. You know, fall off his bike. I mean, it's like, I just don't have control and it won't matter what town I live in, whether those things happen.

So just the things that we can hold onto, they truly are not serving us. So that's, I, I, I hope I'm identifying the difference between the two, because I would be horrified. if any person read my book or worked with me and thought that my goal was to say, don't feel your emotions, replace your thought with something else and move on.

No, no, no, no, no, no. It is definitely not that it's a lot more nuanced and ironically, a lot more simple.

Monica: So I'm just gonna glean what I learned from you about this. And, and you can tell me if I'm, if I'm on the right track, worry, like you said is not an emotion. It's a thought, it's the ruminating over negative outcomes,

Kelley: Yep.

Monica: but harder emotions, uncomfortable emotions can still be productive.

And those are the ones we want to move through and process and allow to still be in the room. And even, you know, worry, like you said, can still be there, but not what you're building the house on. Is that the,

Kelley: Yes. And here's it. Here's the thing too, if we try and you and I have a similar brain, if we try to understand it right here, right now, we won't, it's not for our

Monica: have to live it.

Kelley: understand. Yeah. And it's also for, again, like I said, I didn't come up with this. It's. It is the, the way that is the way, you know, whether you're looking at Buddhism or the fundamentals of, of any faith, it's faith by definition, that can you say, I feel really scared.

Okay. This is me. I feel really scared about these big decisions and the things that are, that are coming to our table. I feel overwhelmed. I definitely feel anxious. I feel all these things. Which one of those is a guidepost. They're all here to guide me. They're all here to serve me. None of this is here to abuse you and hurt you, you know, you are made in perfect order.

So I think when emotions are coming to your table, listen to them, they are really crucial. And you know, something, Martha Beck said one time that really stuck in my head was when something feels warm walk that way,

Monica: Hmm.

Kelley: when it doesn't don't. Right? In this case, worry is not gonna help you.

Monica: Yeah.

Kelley: Fear's going to help you, you know that pit in your stomach that you just want it to go away.

That's helping you they're guideposts. Right. So this would take a whole other podcast where we would get into a, a more dynamic consideration of what happens when we fall into say clinical depression. You know, what's happening to our brain flow is not for you. If you are suffering from clinical depression.

I say at the very beginning of the book, I would not like to see any person. My background's in clinical psychology as well. And. I would not want to see anybody in clinical at clinical state trying to do this work right here right now that there's there's therapy's gonna be really helpful, you know all kinds of differences.

I won't even get into it. For me, this work is a little bit more beneficial when you've got your your bearings life is manageable, but you're finding yourself really falling into that trap more often than you would like. That's where we wanna begin.

Monica: It's like getting sucked into the curve balls and, and just trying to navigate those

Kelley: Yep. But you're not drowning,

Monica: Yes. I'm so glad you differentiate that because so many don't and that's where again, women get in the patterns of being like that didn't work and they blame themselves, which kind

Kelley: No,

Monica: makes them keep spiraling.

So thank you for doing that. So let's say women are ready to. They're the, they're the ones we're speaking to. Like they're the

ones who are not in the clinical zone. But they're, they're ready to kind of try to practice this a little

Kelley: yeah. Or they're just tired of getting stuck in that icky spot.

Monica: Mm-hmm

Kelley: yeah.

Monica: what are some ways that they can start?

You talked about that one practice you did in the middle of the night. That was a great one, I thought. But where, what else could they do or any tips that you have for them?

Kelley: You're gonna laugh. I'm so hesitant to give quick tips because, and I'll tell you why I can. I'm definitely gonna give you something cuz I won't walk away without giving you anything. But what I will also say is my sweet loves all of us, myself included. This is a journey . There is no, there, there,

Monica: Mm.

Kelley: although you should say, oh, they're there to

Monica: yeah, yeah.

Kelley: but there is no, there, there you, aren't going to get somewhere.

It's not going to magical stop you, you know?

Monica: not gonna arrive.

Kelley: No, sometimes you are gonna open your toolbox when you're building your house. And some days you're gonna need a hammer and some days you're gonna need a shovel and some days you're gonna need, you know, a wrench it's do you have 'em all in your toolbox. If you just have a hammer, you're gonna smash.

'em all the bits. Every single time you try to work on something. Maybe something needs a little bit more nuanced. These are tools that are built to help you through the course of your life. Not to magically.

Monica: Fix.

Kelley: and fix something. It's a slow process, but it's a worthy process.

Monica: We speak the same language,

Kelley: Yeah. And someday, yeah, someday some way somehow let me put it this way. If you are uncomfortable enough, you'll start. Looking seeking. If we're building a house, you're gonna go to home Depot. You're gonna buy those five classic tools that you need to begin, but your house isn't built yet. And you know, it can't be yet, but you're ready for that process because what you know is that house is going to protect you.

It will be a safe Haven. It will be someplace that you can count on. Then God forbid it gets taken out by a tornado. That would be a big ski, wouldn't it? Right. That might be clinical depression. You'll rebuild. It's just gonna be a bit harder. But typically that house that we're looking to build by starting to work is the place where we're going to feel like we can breathe a little bit under that roof, but you gotta build the house.

Monica: mm-hmm

Kelley: that's part of the, the thing. And I imagine that your audience. Already built their houses or has a lot of tools already in their boxes and all the things. So if you still find yourself that having found the tools that, that are truly helpful, keep looking and, and you know, of course, I'm going to say, look at flow, but then I'm going to say, if it doesn't resonate with you, don't stop.

This isn't your problem. This isn't your lack of ability. This is not hearing it in the right form just yet, you know, to get to that toolbox that works for you and to get to that house that is protecting you from storm.

You have to start. These are habit shifts. These are brain chemistry shifts. They happen slowly and over time, you know, everybody loves the, the to compare sort of how we shift our brain to how we shift our body. If I want to lose a hundred pounds, it's not gonna happen overnight.

I'm going to have to commit to a slow journey and also likely the faster I do it, the more likely I am to return to that weight versus the slower I do it, the more likely I am to live out the rest of my time, you know, in a, in a, in a way that I feel comfortable with or whatever my goal is, the same works for our spiritual growth and our spiritual development.

So my, my one tip is just begin and it's okay. And even if you felt like you've begun a thousand times before begin again, Or keep adding. But for fun, quick tips, because

Monica: both. Yeah,

Kelley: they're fun. You know, they're fun. I actually start my book with what I call the foundations of flow, because I don't believe that any of us can truly do this. If you haven't first put the foundation and just to completely push that metaphor right into the ground. If you put a house without a foundation might be cute, might get some good wallpaper, you know, and some great lighting fixtures, but good luck. The second one thing happens, you know, that sucker's going down and there goes all your cute work.

So for this, I say, we need three things. Every human needs them. I call them the three "m's" and they stand for munch move and meditate. Again, folks, this might feel annoying. I get it. Cuz we're all like I know, I know. However, you might relate to this. How many times have you worked with somebody and they're just in a fit and you say, well, what did you eat today?

I had coffee this morning. Okay. You can go in the kitchen, get a banana and then call me back. You know? I mean, we, these are so simple and silly, but nourish your body. Try to nourish your body in the morning. Do that one small thing, however, small it is meditate. I do this in my book and I'm not just trying to plug the book, but I want, I it's important for me to delineate.

I've never been successful at classic meditation techniques like transcendental meditation. I was trained in it. I just can't. I struggle. I'm not gonna stand I'm crying, but I just struggle with it. So I've shifted my meditation practice to consistent things that I do throughout the day. One of them I call wash the hair, when I'm in the shower and I'm washing my hair, your family's gonna think something's gone completely awry. You can either say it in your head, or you can say it out loud. I just say, wash the hair, wash the hair, wash the hair, wash the hair while I'm doing it. And the reason why is because the alternative is something to the effect of, did I pick up the kids at this time?

Where did I put that present? Who's did I not call back? What email did I not check? Okay. You guys all

Monica: The ruminating. Yeah,

Kelley: Ruminating. There's two choices. One is I identify what I'm doing in the moment, stay in it. Or I go straight into like, you know, rapid fire brain BS. So I, I lay out a few options in that way.

So that's my meditate, not levitating in the woods, not, you know, I mean, yes, please do that. I know people that

Monica: could do that

do it.

Kelley: yeah. Do it please. I'm not saying don't do it. I'm saying if you happen to be like, It's all good. There's some options in there. And the last one is move, which is, and I wanted, I want your audience to hear this from me because I used to get really like triggered by this.

I have a thing called Ehler's Danlo syndrome. It's a hypermobility disorder, but it manifests in chronic pain. I, I live in a lot of chronic pain. There were a few years. Where it's hard to describe how hard it was for me to move my body really at, at any time. So when somebody's like, well, exercise, this isn't exercise.

I wanna clarify exercise, fine, go. If you're an exer, do that too. Sometimes when I was back in that place, I could lift my arm up and down, up and down. That was my move for the day. The next day. It. Stand up, walk to the kitchen back. Boom. Okay. Now it's walked around the block. Now it's walked two times around the block to on this day now, whatever day we're talking about this, I walk every day for about 30 minutes.

You know, I, I, that's what I do and you'll get there some movement of some kind, whatever your body can handle, whatever ability you have. Do what you can to, to start to put your body in motion and this, by the way, this is the oldest of the old, so, right. Yeah. We have become incredibly sedentary. Yes. They actually did a study and I don't remember who did it, so forgive me, but the same, they saw the same effects for 30 to 40 minutes of light to moderate movement a day with antidepressants.

Wow. That's phenomenal. I've also taken antidepressants. I'm a big fan. Let me just put it all out there, guys.

Monica: I appreciate it.

Kelley: saying, no to that either. You gotta do what you gotta do for you. I think that's fascinating. So my fast, my fast ones for you are much moving meditate. They, they have, they begin the process.

Monica: that is again, like when you said when I said earlier we speak the same language. That is a huge part of what we teach here is, you know, small wins build over time and it's with every single thing it's spiritually, it's physically it's habit wise, it's relationship wise. And this is of course not gonna be any different, but I love that you gave us some foundational ways for them to get started.

And to me, it's a lot about that regulation piece. You know, it's both mind and body. I like that those three 3m. Do that?

Kelley: Three S I'm clearly a fan of things you can remember easily, you know, I'm like three S flow. What is flow, finding love over worry. It's also Wolf spelled backwards. And my name's Kelly Wolf and flow is Wolf spelled backwards. So I'm like, Ooh, that's easy to remember. Yeah. How about that? So bizarre. But so cool that.

Also side note that's flow I came up with the concept of flow before I realized it was my name spelled.

Monica: that's

Kelley: So, but I would say that is an identifier of being in a state of flow as well.

Monica: Mm-hmm so let's, let's leave with just one small thing a woman can do. Let's say she gets a, a small c curve. Let's start with the small C and of maybe it's one of the three ends, or maybe it's that little practice you shared about in the middle of the night thing. What is one thing she can do to begin to practice this process of flow of choosing love over worry.

Kelley: so small c curve ball. You're in your car. You've got a little space nobody's in the car with you and there's really nothing else you can do except for drive. And here we go. Jump on that worry roller coaster, you know, it's boy, it's fun. It's interesting. Maybe you're a little agro with the drivers around you because you're on the worry roller coaster.

The first thing you can do. I want you to stop. I want you to do this one thing and then stop. Don't take it any further. Don't try to do the next steps. Don't go anywhere with it. Go. Oh, I'm worrying. That's it?

Monica: Yes.

Kelley: more than that. It's just, you can say it out loud. You can say it in your head. You can do it however you want.

Just go. Oh, I'm worrying. And then oftentimes you'll go right back to the same. That's fine. Like I said, I don't want you to jump ahead. I want you to

Monica: the muscle.

Kelley: just do that. That's all you gotta do. That's where we're gonna start name it. We're going to start right there. It's in the flow process. It stands for finding that's becoming the observer.

That's identifying that has no action involved. Zero. Yeah.

Monica: Oh, Kelly, I just wanna keep talking. We have so much more to learn from you. But where should they go? If they're ready to learn more from you?

Kelley: If you know, if this is. Pushing your heart and you're feeling like this makes sense to you get the book. It doesn't, I make very little on the book just, but if you want or get it at the library or, you know, whatever you need to do, get the book, it will map this out for you in a way that I believe will serve people.

So you can do that. You can buy it on Amazon flow, finding love over worry. You can go to my. is flow by Kelly wolf.com and that's Kelly with an E Y K E L L E Y. And no eon Wolf, obviously, cuz that would spell flow backwards folks. And I'm also on Instagram and I'm just Kelly Wolf on Instagram.

And you know, I just wanna say to people too, you know, when we're talking about that, that sensation and you were talking about our feelings, if this feels good, Listen to that and let flow be your next thing that you put in your toolbox. If this doesn't resonate with you, take this as a sign that you get to keep looking until something feels like the thing.

And then go ahead and start digging your well there because there's water everywhere for all of us. You just have to keep digging.

Monica: That's so generously given. Thank you. Thank you for your time.

Kelley: Oh, it was an absolute pleasure. Thank you.

Monica: What is one thing she can do to begin to practice this process of flow of choosing worry over, over?

Well, love over worry. Sorry. I messed that up

What is one thing she can do to begin to practice this process of flow of choosing worry over, over?

Well, love over worry. Sorry. I messed that up